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Panthers' Position Changes

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Panthers' Position Changes

Post by dwevans on Sun Sep 24, 2017 1:56 pm



Last edited by dwevans on Sun Sep 24, 2017 1:57 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Tags)
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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by brza37 on Tue Sep 26, 2017 10:36 am


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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by warrior9674 on Tue Sep 26, 2017 10:44 am

Yeppppp

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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by dwevans on Wed Nov 29, 2017 7:51 pm

Two fairly easy ones:

TJ Barnes LE to NT/4-3 DT

Kyle Williams LE  to 4-3 DT
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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by brza37 on Wed Nov 29, 2017 8:14 pm

@dwevans wrote:Two fairly easy ones:

TJ Barnes LE to NT/4-3 DT

Kyle Williams LE  to 4-3 DT
Fine with me.

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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by warrior9674 on Wed Nov 29, 2017 8:18 pm

Yeppp

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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by Bishbosh1985 on Wed Nov 29, 2017 10:10 pm

ok with me

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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by dwevans on Sun Dec 03, 2017 6:50 pm

Jack Mormino 3-4 ROLB to 4-3 RE



 Martinez Reynaud DE - 4-3 DT



Both are within the limits that already exist in the game. Mormino is a Vic Beasley Jr clone and has the size and strength to cope at RE. He is a premium edge rusher. He was drafted by the Panthers in the first round to take over from Addison and and real havoc from a 7 or 9 technique. Whilst his speed is at the upper end for his position, this is why he was a 1st round pick and there are plenty of ends (and 3-4 OLBs who would be 4-3 ends) who are around the 87/88 speed mark.
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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by dwevans on Mon Dec 04, 2017 9:57 am



Last edited by dwevans on Mon Dec 04, 2017 12:05 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by warrior9674 on Mon Dec 04, 2017 11:48 am

The end to DT is ok, there is a rule we have which I haven't got time to find at moment regarding high attributes, does his 88 speed put him top ten for DE's if not ok with me.

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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by dwevans on Mon Dec 04, 2017 12:04 pm

Yes, but do you think its time we looked at the whole picture rather than one attribute? That seems a little backwards.

He's not a bum with 90 speed and no finesse moves. He is an elite edge rusher and when i'm in an 4-3 Over he would play in the ROLB Over spot, but if i'm in 4-3 Wide 9 he would surely line up at DE in the 9 tech. I targeted him for this very role.

He was a first round pick because he's an elite talent in physical stats as well as his technical ones. If someone wanted to move Vic Beasley back to LE would you say no? Equally Mack or Jones the rookie that the Ravens selected as alternative examples.

At 6'4 he has the length to play on the edge, he has the finesse moves and he has the strength and block shedding to cope against the run.

All of the above should be considered. There are some stat limits that we should have in place, but physical talent shouldn't be a barrier for players that are also elite talent otherwise. It would seem weird if he would be accepted if his speed was 86, but not when 88. He is already in the top 10 for outside linebackers so the rule makes little sense as he would be prohibited from moving either way if that was the only thing we went on.
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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by Bishbosh1985 on Mon Dec 04, 2017 2:13 pm

We have to be careful when comparing players attributes to the NFL. Keep in mind this is a video game and sometimes we have to do certain things that are not necessarily 'right', but are best for the good of the league because of EA's loopholes.

There are several good points made by DW above, but there are also some holes as EA don't do logic too well.

I.e one comment above stands out about him being elite and not a bum with 90 spd - which suggests the complete opposite to the guidelines we are trying to maintain, by saying it should be ok for a top prospect but NOT a low prospect is unbalanced.

I feel an extra-ordinary AGM coming on Smile

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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by dwevans on Mon Dec 04, 2017 2:58 pm

Thanks for the consideration Bish. I'm not asking for anything other than to stick within the games existing limits but it actually would seem much less sim to me to keep him as a 4-3 OLB.

All I meant by the comment about being an elite player was actually based on the bias of computer games. I am not trying to cheese with speed. I am just moving a player to his appropriate position who also just happens to be quick. I would be a lot more understanding if this was someone who was just fast with poor FMV, STR,BSH or PMV. If that was the case I would agree it was less acceptable. Equally my real life comparisons are actually asking you to look at these players in Madden.

I hope I have made enough points. I will accept what you chose but please bear in mind that this slightly narrow approach to position changes was why I created the calculator. I would encourage you to play around with it to see what you think. Preseason seems the ideal opportunity to do that.
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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by FraserOliver17 on Mon Dec 04, 2017 3:14 pm

Just to chime in where I've not been asked to. I was hoping to draft this Mormino and move him to DE. Hes got top pass rush moves, but poor coverage skills. As a pure pass rusher he would not be any good as an OLB in a 4-3 but obviously would be a key piece of a D in a 3-4. flip side is he wouldnt be used effectively as a 3-4 DE but would be a key piece in a 4-3 as a DE. Think that scheme needs to be a major consideration for this scenario
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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by Bishbosh1985 on Mon Dec 04, 2017 4:45 pm

There's much to consider guys, which is why we discuss this stuff.

DW - your input is always worthy of reading and your time and effort with the calcs are much appreciated - the right things done for the right reasons that help in many ways.

It's the glitchy stuff that we need to fix, and sometimes this can present as a slightly narrower approach to some things - in this case, pos changes. 

Maybe the more unusual ones are worthy of further discussion.

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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by dwevans on Mon Dec 04, 2017 5:23 pm

Of course Bish - I understand. I look forward to learning the fate of my first round pick. I hope it wasn't a wasted choice. Crying or Very sad
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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by Mattanite on Mon Dec 04, 2017 5:39 pm

@dwevans wrote:Of course Bish - I understand. I look forward to learning the fate of my first round pick. I hope it wasn't a wasted choice. Crying or Very sad

Tbh, even if he stays at ROLB to replace your often injured ageing vet, it's not a wasted pick as he'll be dynamite on the odd LB blitz and a great user LB. I considered him or SS Ali at pick 25 but I had other needs and didn't want the risk.
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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by dwevans on Mon Dec 04, 2017 5:46 pm

Thanks Matt but he quite clearly is best suited as a pass rusher and I think my argument is pretty solid for that. I already have Perry (who I used one of my 3 re-signings on last year) to take over from Davis and user and I wouldn't have selected a LB, least of all a user one in the first round of the draft.
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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by brza37 on Thu Dec 07, 2017 11:50 am

34 OLB and 43 DE are both Edge players and since he fits the mould there is no problem with making the switch to me. He would be tops in speed regardless of position too. The rule of not being allowed to switch if "that would put the player in the top 5 at any position specific or athletic rating for the new position" only applies if he's not already top 5 at his current position. He is also a good pass rusher at either position and not just a dud late pick that was drafted for speed and can become a stud if moved. He is also a rookie with a 34 Pass RUsher profile and not a veteran who has always played a different position, where the top 5 rule applies more. So based on those reasons I approve.

I have posted this before but I basically see the following positions as interchangeable:
43 DE = 34 OLB
43 LB = 34 ILB
43 DT = 34 DE if less than 310 lbs
43 DT = 34 NT if more than 310 lbs

There may also be some some cases for a 43 DE moving to 34 DE or 34 OLB moving to 43 OLB but those are far fewer and need to be handled on a case by case instance since they involve more variables (height, weight, STR, SPD, ACC, ZCV etc.)

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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by dwevans on Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:51 pm

Thanks @brza37. Can @bishbosh1985 and @warrior9674 give their final decision please.
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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by Bishbosh1985 on Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:01 pm

Agree with the boss

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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by dwevans on Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:36 pm

Further Changes 7.12.17 - The first 4 are pretty simple.

Willie Henry DE to 4-3 DT

Jeremy Cash 4-3 ROLB to 4-3 MLB

Brian Gritton FS to SS

Cameron Tom LG to RG

Would you also allow me to move Shaq Hill to HB? He is a bit of a gadget player and not overly fast for a HB. He has decent enough trucking, elusiveness, BCV, carrying, juke and spin moves to make it at as a 3rd down/ change of pace back. He also is an abysmal route runner. If allowed I would use him as a situational player in the slot or out of the backfield but would never be my starting running back due to his slight undersized nature. He is basically a shitter version of Tarik Cohen and only becomes a 64 OVR HB who may not even make my final 53.

Let me know @brza37 @warrior9674, @bishbosh1985 @meistereder69 and @ltown27ers
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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by Bishbosh1985 on Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:56 pm

WR to HB is a no, just like CB to safety has to be a no too.

We are having many discussions about DE/DT/OLB's - adding this in (albeit as an isolated occurrence) would throw the doors wide open for pretty much any change.

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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by dwevans on Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:58 pm

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Re: Panthers' Position Changes

Post by warrior9674 on Thu Dec 07, 2017 7:14 pm

All ok for me DW except Hill ,  it's a flat no in the rules,  don't need those gates opening.

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